Video Poker Forum

I read somewhere that even though the hands on the STP machines could come out "randomly" the casino operator can still change the frequency and the value of the multiplier and it is perfectly within gaming regulations. The reason I even bother to mention is I like to play a hundred play STP at Harrah's AC. I started playing there sometime this summer and I play DW at higher denominations. The first several visits it was a pleasure to play it because even though the individual payouts are low, the frequency and good value of the multipliers made up for it. On several occasions I even got lucky and got a pretty high value multiplier holding 3 deuces. Since I play either a dime or a quarter it is always a handpay. I must have received around 4 or 5 handpays in a span of 2 months. Then, all of a sudden, the frequency of the multiplier was drastically reduced to almost a non-existant one and when it did show up always a 2 or a 3 times. To the extent that they are impossible to play now because I bet 600 instead of 500 units and with low payouts I loose my ass if the multiplier doesn't show up. Anyway, I read somewhere it is legal to manipulate the multiplier. Any comments?

Technically the manufacturer of the game could allow adjustment of multipliers; however, I've never heard the manufacturer allowing that ability for super times pay.

Help screens for STP and Double STP have traditionally listed the "average" multiplier value in the help/rules screen.

If the "average" values are any different than this, I would be weary.

Super Times Pay: 4.05X
Double Super Times Pay: 4.01X

I rarely play STP because the extra coin increases the pay back by only about .25% if I recall correctly and the pay tables are often lower than other machines. With an average of 1 in 18 hands average STP multiplier, you are betting on hitting at the right time a hand and multiplier. I have often practiced counting the number of hands between hitting a multiplier. Once went up to 100+ hands before catching a multiplier.   When the multiplier is occurring frequently it will eventually balance out.

Hoping you always hit the high frequency multipliers with great hands.

I do not play Super Times Pay at a real casino due to bad pay tables, but the rate for each multiplier (2-3-4-5-8-10) is on the WizardOfOdds site.

The average multiplier is exactly what Vman96 stated. The average trigger rate is 1 in 15 hands.

http://wizardofodds.com/games/video-pok ... times-pay/

I do enjoy STP for fun on this website.

I have a special place in my heart for STP because my largest jackpot ever was hit on an STP DDB machine in Laughlin some years ago for $73K.

However, that said, I also know that it can be a tremendously losing game.

It is true that the multiplier average is appx 1 multiplier per 15 hands, with the multiplier value being weighted toward 2s, then 3s, then 5s, then 4s, then 8s and finally 10s. However, as Lucky Larry wrote, you can go a long time between multipliers. The flip side is that it does indeed balance out over time, so if you have a sufficient bankroll to ride out a long dry period, you will be rewarded with a period of frequent multipliers.

I have been told by someone in the business that the multiplier RNG does not generate its numbers in conjunction with the card dealing RNG, but rather independently. Thus, in a dry period, it is possible to slow down or pause your play to allow the multiplier RNG to get to a different plane. This, of course, makes not a whit of difference over time, but short term it does seem to make a difference for me.

The two basic styles of STP play that I have seen used by regulars seem to be: (a) Roveer's style, which is to ride it out over many hours and many hands in order to survive long enough to catch the big one; and (b) what I call the slot machine style, which is to play very briefly in hopes of quickly getting lucky enough to catch a big multiplier and a big hand at the same time. My style is in the middle --- I bring a large enough roll to give it a fair shot, but I don't keep flushing money down the hole if it's clearly gonna be a bad night.

In addition, because STP is the ultimate gamble --- lining up not one but TWO critical pieces of luck at the same time --- I don't always go with the conventional wisdom on what to hold, but rather sometimes swing for the fence. Bob Dancer says all multiplier games should be played the same way as you would play the single hand non-multiplier version, but with STP I don't necessarily always agree with that.

I don't quite understand why all of you consider an STP multiplier to be an RNG generated one? I do not believe it is. Just like "dream card" or any other VP game that's altered to bet more in hopes of catching something big!  When "dream card" debuted some years ago I played it exclusively for days at a time and it was appearing quite regularly. It's been "adjusted" since and no one gets near it now to the point that most casinos take it off the floor as it is unplayable and therefore unprofitable for the casinos. Seems to me all added features on VP are like bonus games on slot machines and largely with predetermined outcome.

I don't quite understand why all of you consider an STP multiplier to be an RNG generated one? I do not believe it is. Just like "dream card" or any other VP game that's altered to bet more in hopes of catching something big!  When "dream card" debuted some years ago I played it exclusively for days at a time and it was appearing quite regularly. It's been "adjusted" since and no one gets near it now to the point that most casinos take it off the floor as it is unplayable and therefore unprofitable for the casinos. Seems to me all added features on VP are like bonus games on slot machines and largely with predetermined outcome.

If the STP multiplier, which appears completely randomly, is not RNG produced, then how do you suggest it makes its way into the game?

Rascal:  I, for one, would love to hear about your $73K jackpot on STP.  It's alway fun to live vicariously through others who have hit a spectacular jackpot.  What denomination were you playing; how many hands; what multiplier did you receive; what hand were you dealt, etc.  If you don't mind sharing it...  Thanks.

Well, how does a bonus round make it into the game when playing slots? Or for that matter how does a "dream card" make it into the game? If it was random, how is it according to the manufacturer it appears a certain percentage of time  during a game and different percentages during different games. Is that random?

[QUOTE=gregorio] I don't quite understand why all of you consider an STP multiplier to be an RNG generated one? I do not believe it is. Just like "dream card" or any other VP game that's altered to bet more in hopes of catching something big!  When "dream card" debuted some years ago I played it exclusively for days at a time and it was appearing quite regularly. It's been "adjusted" since and no one gets near it now to the point that most casinos take it off the floor as it is unplayable and therefore unprofitable for the casinos. Seems to me all added features on VP are like bonus games on slot machines and largely with predetermined outcome.

If the STP multiplier, which appears completely randomly, is not RNG produced, then how do you suggest it makes its way into the game?[/QUOTE]Sorry Rascal. Forgot to quote. Well, how does a bonus round make it into the game when playing slots?
Or for that matter how does a "dream card" make it into the game? If it
was random, how is it according to the manufacturer it appears a certain
percentage of time  during a game and different percentages during
different games. Is that random?