Some Dos and Don'ts of Single Coin Play

[FloridaPhil]

Most members of this forum know I play a lot of single coin video poker.   Single coin play has many advantages to a recreational player. You don't hear much about this as it has no place in a professional strategy based on odds and no one is getting paid to promote single coin anything.   For this reason, I felt it would be a good idea to open a discussion on this subject and throw out a few things I believe. 1. Unless you are a professional with computer perfect skills, valuable comps and access to net positive games, you will lose more playing video poker than you will win long term.  This is a fact of life and there is nothing you can do about it.  What you can do is reduce that loss to a minimum.  Aside from refusing to play any overall negative game (Bob Dancer's strategy), there are only two ways to accomplish this... risk less or play slower.2. Depending upon the game, the royal bonus is worth approximately 1.5%.  Because most video poker games are negative, you are actually losing less playing single coin because the overall money wagered is so much less. For most players, same denomination single coin play costs less per hour even giving up the royal bonus.  3. Single coin play allows you to play more hands with the same bankroll allowing you more chances at a jackpot.4. Single coin play allows you to move up to max coins if things go well.  Moving down to single coin after the damage has been done is always a loser.5. Occasionally single coin play at a higher denomination gets you better odds than max coins at a lower denomination even without the royal bonus.  6. If you are going to play single coin, never switch to single coin after you have lost money in an attempt to stay in the game.  If you do this, I guarantee you will catch a jackpot at single coin and ruin any chance you have of catching up.  This will also sour you on ever playing single coin again which is a shame because it will help you more days than it will hurt you.7. The best way to play single coin is to start off playing single coin from the beginning and stick with it unless you are significantly ahead for the day.   Don't get tricked into thinking there is only one jackpot in the game and if you miss one at single coin it's a big disaster.  Think about how much money you are saving, not how much money you are missing by not playing max coins.8.  Be aware that single coin hand strategy is different than max coins.  Learn these differences and realize that not going for the royal all the time often creates more paying hands along the way.9 . I never play 2-3 or 4 coins, I always either play one coin or max coins. Playing 2-3-4 coins is a waste of money with no significant gain.10.  Recreational players play for entertainment.  To many players entertainment is experiencing the thrill of a royal flush.  If you're in that camp, don't play single coin.  You will be disappointed and your friends will tell you you're an idiot for not playing max coins even though you probably saved more than the royal was worth.For me, playing single coin reduces the stress of playing video poker, leaves me more money in my pocket and allows me to enjoy the casino experience instead of being depressed 90% of the time.I hope this thread opens an intelligent discussion on this subject.  If you think playing single coin is stupid, pull out your check book and see how much it's costing you to play (assuming you want to know).  If you're happy with that number, that's great.  If not, know that there is a way to enjoy the game and the casino experience without losing all that money.  Let the games begin!  

[jmmrx]

I respect your post! I trust your method works. I will be going to Vegas shortly and wanted to know the best place to play Deuces Wild with your CS method. Does the Golden Nugget in Las Vegas have any particular machines that will respect the CS? I would like to know the DIFFERENCE in strategy with CS for single coin play, i.e. how does the playing strategy change regarding the hands? Perhaps you have a strategy guide for this? Also, what about Super Times Pay Poker? I enjoy this game but wondered how does the CS apply to game like that where you have multiple games. Lastly, My wife enjoys JOB. If I can find a 95.4% machine, should she play the CS method in the same way as if it were the Wild Games? Thanks. I will, of course, share my feedback on CS after my trip to Vegas. Where, from your experience, is the best place to play VP in Vegas(which Casino)using CS?

[jmmrx]

Sorry, I meant 99.54% JOB

[FloridaPhil]

If you are going to play in Vegas, you don't need CS or short coin
play.  You should be able to find near 100% games and assuming you know
good hand strategy will be able to get your money's worth with max
coin play.   Under those conditions, I would find the best games I
could, play max coins and take your chances. CS is a recreational strategy.  It's goal is to allow you to play more hands with the same money while retaining the possibility of a max coin jackpot. It will not make you rich, but it will make your money last longer and some say it provides a more exciting and enjoyable experience.   I agree with this last statement as any strategy that keeps me from regretting my time at the casino is welcome.  I do not play CS all the time.  I use it when I need to play for multiple days and have no choice but to play games with odds under 98%. Over 98% I think the cost to play is worth the possibility of a royal.  Nothing will keep you from long term losses on a negative expectation video poker game, but you don't have to overpay for the short term chance of a win.I do not recommend using single coin or CS for Jacks or Better.  A royal flush is the only big jackpot and it is too much effort waiting 40,000 hands to experience a short coin royal.  CS works best with single line traditional wild card games.  There are reasons for this as outlined in the information contained in the link below.   I also do not recommend CS for beginning players.  Getting a royal is so significant to them, they would be devastated if they got one at single coin.  I've been playing video poker for well over 10 years and my wife and I play over 500,000 hands a year.  Hitting a royal flush is not at all special to us, so we don't chose to pay just to see one.I like to play single coin DDB.  This game has such a high variance that you need lots of money to last through the very long dry spells.  It doesn't make financial sense to dump truck loads of money into a negative DDB game, so I play single coin which accomplishes the same thing.I'm glad you asked these questions.  There is no "one size fits all"  universal video poker strategy.  Playing CS or single coin gives you 5 times as many hands for the same money as max coins.  The take away is you give up the royal flush bonus.   If playing longer and losing less has value to you, you may like it.  Some players don't care about the long term cost, they just want to see max coin jackpots.  It's your money, so play the way you want and don't worry about what others may say.

[alpax]

I can tell a lot of thought went into the post, thanks FP for all the clarification.

I might also add, it is also vital to practice using software that supports short coin play, such as Video Poker for Winners, freeslots dot com website, or the Wizard of Odds website. It lengthens the royal flush cycle for better chances at intermediate hits, if you use the max coin strategy (which is not supported on the GOLD membership on the site) you will lose more than the 1.5% theoretical difference.

A good Vegas casino to play out the CS is The Gold Coast (near the restrooms next to Ping Pang Pong restaurant). They have nickel denomination VP so it is better to max bet that as the "single coin" and then the "max coin" bet will be switching to the quarter denomination and max betting that. If you are moving to dollars, the bank that has 50 cents/ $1 / $2 is not far away and closer to that restaurant.

[Vman96]

A good Vegas casino to play out the CS is The Gold Coast (near the restrooms next to Ping Pang Pong restaurant). They have nickel denomination VP so it is better to max bet that as the "single coin" and then the "max coin" bet will be switching to the quarter denomination and max betting that. If you are moving to dollars, the bank that has 50 cents/ $1 / $2 is not far away and closer to that restaurant.

They have 9/6 JoB at nickels??? 9/5? If it's 8/5 or worse, I would bet one quarter instead. Went to Hollywood STL yesterday. Lady next to me and her husband were one coining 9/6 JoB. It's the right play though because nickels on that bank is an ugly 7/5. But they are the first couple I noticed betting one quarter vs. five nickels. Felt bad for the lady though...she hit AAAA4 on JoB for $6.25, doh!

At Gold Coast last trip I found "Airport Deuces" (98.91%) on their "up to 99.8%" units for nickels. I was pleased with that. NSUD (99.73%) for quarters+ I believe.   

[alpax]

[QUOTE=alpax]

A good Vegas casino to play out the CS is The Gold Coast (near the restrooms next to Ping Pang Pong restaurant). They have nickel denomination VP so it is better to max bet that as the "single coin" and then the "max coin" bet will be switching to the quarter denomination and max betting that. If you are moving to dollars, the bank that has 50 cents/ $1 / $2 is not far away and closer to that restaurant.

They have 9/6 JoB at nickels??? 9/5? If it's 8/5 or worse, I would bet one quarter instead. Went to Hollywood STL yesterday. Lady next to me and her husband were one coining 9/6 JoB. It's the right play though because nickels on that bank is an ugly 7/5. But they are the first couple I noticed betting one quarter vs. five nickels. Felt bad for the lady though...she hit AAAA4 on JoB for $6.25, doh!

At Gold Coast last trip I found "Airport Deuces" (98.91%) on their "up to 99.8%" units for nickels. I was pleased with that. NSUD (99.73%) for quarters+ I believe.   [/QUOTE]

You are correct, I was thinking about FP's needs which is Deuces Wild and not jmmrx's needs which is Jacks or Better.

The nickel and dime jacks or better is indeed 8/5 and the quarters to $5 are set for 9/6. The $10 denomination is set for 9/5.

The Deuces Wild are exactly as you've described.

Edited to add: I recall The Palms across the street has 50 play 1 cent 9/6 Jacks or Better, probably better off playing that if you can just play one line.

[Vman96]

Edited to add: I recall The Palms across the street has 50 play 1 cent 9/6 Jacks or Better, probably better off playing that if you can just play one line.

I believe that has no minimum wager, so one could in theory. But even I'm not cheap enough for one line of pennies.

[FloridaPhil]

A good question is when to play max coins and when to switch to single coin strategies.   Contrary to what he and some people may think, I am in total agreement with Bob Dancer's methodologies when it comes to advantage play.  Problem is he ignores the average player that does not have access to overall positive opportunities.  This leads the majority of players to follow his strategies on seriously negative games which costs them more money than necessary.On an overall 100% or greater video poker game, there is no question... play max coins.  As the odds curve lowers, there is a point where the odds are so negative that going for a royal is not worth the cost.   I'm sure Bob would say that point is 99.99%.  As recreational players we don't mind paying a little for the chance at a royal, but playing max coins on a game where you are guaranteed to lose twice the royal flush bonus on a chance you will see one is not a good bet.How much are you willing to pay for a royal?  If you are new to the game, that number may be infinite because hitting a royal is a goal you strive for.   As you become more experienced and royals don't mean as much, you begin to see them differently.   Also, the amount of time you are going to play comes into the mix.  If I only have two hours to play, I'm going to play max coins because even if I lose the amount of the loss is insignificant.  If I need to play a 96% machine for three solid days, you better believe I'm going to play single coin.  if players considered the cost of playing video poker instead of always concentrating on the rare wins, I think they would be better overall players. 

[djc32]

They have nickel denomination VP so it is better to max bet that as the "single coin" and then the "max coin" bet will be switching to the quarter denomination and max betting that.

I agree.

It seems to me the benefits of "single coin play" is no different than a max bet quarter player who is now playing max bet nickels with the same bank roll, and taking the occasional pot shot at quarters.

Plus,nickel games aren't always going to have a worse pay tables than quarters ,in all the different casinos through out the country .Sure ,most places do lower the pay table, but in some cases even with the reduced pay table for nickels, it will be an almost equal return with the reduction you get playing single coin quarters.

It would probably be a good idea for players to scout a casino before trying CS or single coin play and see what different options they may have available to them ,rather than just assuming single coin quarters is always going to better than max coin nickels.